100 yards and beyond…?

[Farmplinker2]

I’ll keep this simple, I purchased my Taipan for target shooting at 100+y all the time eventually.

I am starting to get bored shooting it at 50 yards right now.

What’s holding me back right now is time and myself (laziness setting up the table, dragging everything out which is a terrible excuse, cause my range is in the front yard lol). Also bought another Airgun.

This seems strangely familiar to me....

 

[Grunt64]

Sure the LRF capabilities are quick and easy to use now but that doesn't mean the human behind the scope is still capable of making the shot on a "critter", there are many other variables besides just hold-overs.

This is true but if you have the Proper technique – Stance, grip, trigger control, breathing these smart scopes can still take a so-so shooter to an expert, Best Smart Rifle Scopes: Top Picks for Enhanced Accuracy and Precision - TopTenReviewed

 

[Grunt64]

Well said.
Hunting and ethics is a whole other thing and we've battled back and forth on that one too
Busted out my S510 this past Sunday and shot 2 pest birds, setting up camp in my yard. First one was offhand @25 and I only wounded it. He bailed to the nearest tree to figure out what happened and I dropped him, this time supported on my deck railing. Second was 43Yards off the back deck rail, he was gone in about 3 seconds. Had it been a 100Y + shot and I wounded him, there would almost be no chance I could have gotten him with a second shot. My be-all end-all plan with my Ghost is .22 Slugs and slugs only out of it. Then? Attempting to show-up my brother with his .22LR and Hmr! It's amazing what airguns can do.

Pcps are amazing, so much so with today's pcps as for hunting deer and smaller, is there any reason not to use a pcp rather than a PB? Most deer around here are takin 100 yards or less, I am a hunter.

 

[Grunt64]

...but the practical limits are moving up. Let's face it, the people coming to this forum, or others, are not the average, and they are not going for that. Like you said there is plenty of video evidence, if not personal, that it (moa groups @100y) is happening more and more. To all those who scream "CHERRY PICKED!" I would say that they are building up to a couple of bushels at this point. It's there for anyone that wants it. We are spending enough money and time on these things, why settle for shooting in front of your feet? Besides, like I have told you before, the distant practice helps your shooting up close too, but not so much the other way around. Nobody is saying to anybody that you have to shoot far but I certainly wouldn't talk anybody out of exploring and expanding their capabilities either. And I certainly would never temper expectations either, what fun is that? These airguns are amazing! They still amaze me. I haven't introduced one firearm guy that wasn't at least impressed by the accuracy, even if they didn't want to get into it all.

Thank you! Very well said.

 

[Pumacarl]

Pcps are amazing, so much so with today's pcps as for hunting deer and smaller, is there any reason not to use a pcp rather than a PB? Most deer around here are takin 100 yards or less, I am a hunter.

I can give you one, admittingly selfish, reason. I would like to see airguns stay under the mainstream public's attention for as long as possible. That is why I don't want them to be more powerful than a .22 rimfire either, so people can't say that there is no difference, and ban them from being shot everywhere. Which is already starting. Big bore matches look like real fun to me, but I would prefer if they happened at firearm matches not airgun ones. Not gonna happen I know. I just always recommend stealth, out of sight(and earshot), out of mind, The laws for hunting with airguns have started to show up in my state and they are as dumb and misinformed as everywhere else. I would have really preferred my sport to not come to the attention of lawmakers who are just trying to look busy by passing laws to appease the unpleasable, nosey, joyless, Karens of the world.

 

[Grunt64]

I can give you one, admittingly selfish, reason. I would like to see airguns stay under the mainstream public's attention for as long as possible. That is why I don't want them to be more powerful than a .22 rimfire either, so people can't say that there is no difference, and ban them from being shot everywhere. Which is already starting. Big bore matches look like real fun to me, but I would prefer if they happened at firearm matches not airgun ones. Not gonna happen I know. I just always recommend stealth, out of sight(and earshot), out of mind, The laws for hunting with airguns have started to show up in my state and they are as dumb and misinformed as everywhere else. I would have really preferred my sport to not come to the attention of lawmakers who are just trying to look busy by passing laws to appease the unpleasable, nosey, joyless, Karens of the world.

I can give you one, admittingly selfish, reason. I would like to see airguns stay under the mainstream public's attention for as long as possible. That is why I don't want them to be more powerful than a .22 rimfire either, so people can't say that there is no difference, and ban them from being shot everywhere. Which is already starting. Big bore matches look like real fun to me, but I would prefer if they happened at firearm matches not airgun ones. Not gonna happen I know. I just always recommend stealth, out of sight(and earshot), out of mind, The laws for hunting with airguns have started to show up in my state and they are as dumb and misinformed as everywhere else. I would have really preferred my sport to not come to the attention of lawmakers who are just trying to look busy by passing laws to appease the unpleasable, nosey, joyless, Karens of the world.

I respect your thoughts, but advancements in every field are inevitable. Humanity is always striving for more. Motorcycles and cars are now exceeding 200 mph, and PCPs are in a race to develop rifles that rival PB. I'm guilty, I have 2 pcps that have more power than a .22, AEA 357-340 fpe and Texan .308- 330 fpe, I am a hunter of coyote, racoons and woodchucks and I enjoy hunting the at long range (100-200) yards and with 150gr there is no suffering.

 

[CTAirgunner]

Imo we are nearing our limitations as we speak, I do know AEA came out with a 7000psi compressor which I personally find INSANE but I do not believe we are going to see many air rifles dumping more than 4000 psi of air per shot , any time soon, there are other gasses we can use, helium for instance but that is not going to be accessible to the masses. With that said, we can always improve projectile, which seems to be whats happening as well as finding the right combo, but I think anything over .257 caliber in airguns is always going to be real far behind PB. This is just my .02 though.

 

[Grunt64]

Imo we are nearing our limitations as we speak, I do know AEA came out with a 7000psi compressor which I personally find INSANE but I do not believe we are going to see many air rifles dumping more than 4000 psi of air per shot , any time soon, there are other gasses we can use, helium for instance but that is not going to be accessible to the masses. With that said, we can always improve projectile, which seems to be whats happening as well as finding the right combo, but I think anything over .257 caliber in airguns is always going to be real far behind PB. This is just my .02 though.

Closer than you think.

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. And my pcp .308 with 150gr 1042 fps and it still has a stock valve.

 

[CTAirgunner]

Closer than you think.

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. And my pcp .308 with 150gr 1042 fps

Highly mistaken , .224 powder burners somewhere in the 2600-3300 fps range.

And to comment on the .308, .308 win shooting 150 gr is somewhere around 2900 fps

My huben .254 was shooting 48 gr boat tails from AvS at 1070 fps with no modifications at all. Never did I even think to compare it to a pb. It's not even close.

We are far far far away from pb capabilities.

I can hit a goofball 250 yards, doesn't mean it's as dangerous as a 690 grain .50 bmg bullet at 250 yards. (690 grains is about 45 grams which is golf ball weight).

 

[CTAirgunner]

An after thought here, and part of it is a point in your favor @Grunt64 , I am not saying that what you showed us via that video isn't dangerous at 110 yards, quite the contrary, its extremely dangerous, clearly, deadly. However, it is still not close to the capability of a powder rifle.

.224 Creedmoor for instance copper creek 60 grain bullet , leaves the muzzle at 3600fps , from 0-100 yards it has essentially zero drop, at 200 yards it has only 1.5 inch of drop, at 500 yards it has only 39 inches (or 3 feet for ease of conversation) of drop.

.254 60 grain boat tail leaving the muzzle at 1200 fps at 100 yards has 1 foot of drop, at 200 it has 5 feet of drop, and at 500 yards it has 37 feet of drop, YES 37 FEET!!! as compared to the 3 feet on the .224 creedmoor.

Lets also not forget wind, that .254 60 grain has 5.5 feet of wind drift in 10 mph winds at 500 yards, the .224 referenced has just over 1 foot of wind drift at 500 yards and only 3.5 feet at 1000 yards.

.....

Anyways, thats enough of me rambling here, I just do not feel we are anywhere close to PB'ers.

 

[Grunt64]

To me shooting anything for hunting 2600-3300 fps in North America is just asking for pass-thru, the energy doesn't dump in the animal ,like I have said most kills happen within 100 yards (deer) Your Huben isn't a very good comparison at 122 fpe.

• Underwater weapons: Pneumatic systems are employed in torpedo launchers, where compressed air propels the torpedo out of the tube before its propulsion system activates.
• Experimental railguns: Some research has explored air-powered mechanisms to assist in launching projectiles and at high speeds, though these are typically combined with electromagnetic systems. Air power is used in many areas, point is, never underestimate the power of air, cleaner, stealthy.
• advancements in science and engineering could make air-powered air guns significantly more powerful. Here are some areas where improvements could lead to enhanced performance:
  1. Higher-pressure systems: Developing materials and designs that can safely handle higher levels of compressed air or gas would increase the force behind the projectile.
  2. Advanced valve technology: More efficient valves could release air more rapidly and precisely, maximizing the energy transfer to the projectile.
  3. Aerodynamics: Optimizing the shape and weight of projectiles could reduce air resistance and improve speed and accuracy.
  4. Hybrid systems: Combining air power with other technologies, such as electromagnetic propulsion, could create hybrid weapons with greater power and versatility.
  5. Materials science: Using stronger and lighter materials for the gun's components could allow for higher pressures and better durability.
• These advancements could push air-powered weapons closer to the performance of traditional firearms, while maintaining benefits like quieter operation and reduced environmental impact.

 

[CTAirgunner]

I am aware of what it will take, the one thing we lack with air is what it will take lol... and I have mentioned it before in other threads.

A 357 magnum propels the bullet with 44000 psi behind it, a 357 texan is under 3600 psi.

It doesn't even need to get as complicated as I got the posts above your last, its as simple as the statement above. Its the propellant used and the force created by the propellant.

We also don't need to start discussing railguns, submarines, or deathstars....

 

[pan60]

I can give you one, admittingly selfish, reason. I would like to see airguns stay under the mainstream public's attention for as long as possible. That is why I don't want them to be more powerful than a .22 rimfire either, so people can't say that there is no difference, and ban them from being shot everywhere. Which is already starting. Big bore matches look like real fun to me, but I would prefer if they happened at firearm matches not airgun ones. Not gonna happen I know. I just always recommend stealth, out of sight(and earshot), out of mind, The laws for hunting with airguns have started to show up in my state and they are as dumb and misinformed as everywhere else. I would have really preferred my sport to not come to the attention of lawmakers who are just trying to look busy by passing laws to appease the unpleasable, nosey, joyless, Karens of the world.

I am not so sure we have a massive amount to worry about on this.
reasons for my thinking is most people are just going to go with a firearm because the airguns at this point in time cant even get close to what most firearm are going excluding the rimfire.
I do think there far more room for improvement then other and I have spoke with mandators that feel the same.
there is a LOT of room for efficiency and valve improvement something we are seeing more and more. every time I turn around there valve improvement that at this time is more shots but theres lots of room fro power improvements as well
I think what slows this down is the ability for many to have access to to the air. no since in making a gun the average person cant air up?

 

[Grunt64]

I am aware of what it will take, the one thing we lack with air is what it will take lol... and I have mentioned it before in other threads.

A 357 magnum propels the bullet with 44000 psi behind it, a 357 texan is under 3600 psi.

It doesn't even need to get as complicated as I got the posts above your last, its as simple as the statement above. Its the propellant used and the force created by the propellant.

We also don't need to start discussing railguns, submarines, or deathstars.... sheesh.

that's just to let you know the science is there and can be transfer to air guns. 15 years ago I bet there where people who thought the same way as you and look now what we have. look back and see the advancements, 7000 psi compared to 2000-3000 psi of that in the past, you limit your thinking. "Many things are improbable, only a few are impossible."

 

[FL22]

We also don't need to start discussing railguns, submarines, or deathstars....

lol, I almost spit out my coffee.

 

[CTAirgunner]

that's just to let you know the science is there and can be transfer to air guns. 15 years ago I bet there where people who thought the same way as you and look now what we have. look back and see the advancements, 7000 psi compared to 2000-3000 psi of that in the past, you limit your thinking. "Many things are improbable, only a few are impossible."

I don't limit my thinking , you don't know me, or how I think. I am going to just agree to disagree with you.

 

[CTAirgunner]

lol, I almost spit out my coffee.

Well its true , lol

 

[Grunt64]

I am not so sure we have a massive amount to worry about on this.
reasons for my thinking is most people are just going to go with a firearm because the airguns at this point in time cant even get close to what most firearm are going excluding the rimfire.
I do think there far more room for improvement then other and I have spoke with mandators that feel the same.
there is a LOT of room for efficiency and valve improvement something we are seeing more and more. every time I turn around there valve improvement that at this time is more shots but theres lots of room fro power improvements as well
I think what slows this down is the ability for many to have access to to the air. no since in making a gun the average person cant air up?

Thats why AEA has a compressor to do just that 7000 psi and only the market can determine what direction air guns will go. How many bikers push the speeds up to 200 mph? but they keep making them, same will go for air guns, AEA MCAR and Airforce TEX-REX are good examples.

 

[Grunt64]

I don't limit my thinking , you don't know me, or how I think. I am going to just agree to disagree with you.

Words and thoughts reveal much about oneself.

 

[Danman]

Speaking of rails, the only thing off the rails is this 100Y thread .
I said it on another thread and I'll say it again. The first produced pcp (Girandoni) air rifle was designed to kill a man @ 100Y. Air tank was the buttstock and could be swapped in the field with another valved full tank, it was 8-900psi and got up to 20shots () per fill and had a magazine system. It was unregulated, simple, sure weak in today's standards, and prone to failure (aka leak!)
Now compare all that to pcps today...not actually that bad?! MAJOR improvements have happened I agree but compare the 2 end results! Seriously. Things can always be tweaked and improved (and will continue to be) but I would agree with @CTAirgunner 100% we are capped out on power potential. And I'm very ok with that. Every advancement comes with a drawback.