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Are Ballistic Coefficients Still Relevant?
- Thread starter hameditor
- Start date
- Latest activity Latest activity:
- Replies 43
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I'd love to see some ballistics numbers and ammo options for the 7mm. Not that I need it, but I really like to run the numbers in Strelok Pro. There has to be quite a bit of work already done and letting people play with the numbers would help sell people on a new round that they didn't even knew they wanted.
- Original poster
- #3
Yes Wolfiek has some BC numbers and we will include them our next piece which will be specifically about the 7mm caliber.
NateChrony
HAM Sharp Shooter
BC numbers are pretty much useless, especially when it comes to Air Rifle ammo.
If you have 2 chronographs, the distance between them, the 2 velocities, the environmental conditions - there is NO WAY to calculate the BC number.
Its really a useless number used for marketing mostly - we need to move away from it.
If you have 2 chronographs, the distance between them, the 2 velocities, the environmental conditions - there is NO WAY to calculate the BC number.
Its really a useless number used for marketing mostly - we need to move away from it.
This will make for an interesting debate, I can’t wait to read. @Franklink any thoughts to the contrary?
.NateChrony
HAM Sharp Shooter
100% more than happy to be proven wrong.This will make for an interesting debate, I can’t wait to read. @Franklink any thoughts to the contrary?
All you'll need to do is post the formula
duchunter007
HAM Sniper
Nate,
Does that include slugs as well? I am fairly new to the PCP world. Can you explain why we should move away from the BC number? Just trying to gain more information. Correct me if I am wrong, but don't you need the BC number
To shoot at targets that you range and plug that data into your Ballistics Calculator?
Thank you
Andrew
NateChrony
HAM Sharp Shooter
ESPECIALLY Slugs!!!
TLDR & bastardised... The BC is a relationship to a "reference" model, G1, G7, RA1, etc...
There's so much variation in slugs for air rifles that there's no valid reference models for the vast, vast majority of slugs.
So you compare it to an incorrect model & fudge the heck out of it to "get a number thats kinda close" - as per one YouTuber that did it recently.
Waytoomany
HAM Specialist
This is going to be an interesting back and forth. Is this not physics?
Waytoomany
duchunter007
HAM Sniper
I have looked at your, Nate Chrony and have thought about buying one as it seems to put out very accurate information,
So, how do you use your numbers in Chairgun Elite, or any Ballistic Calculator, without a BC number when shooting pigeons or rats at various distances? Like I said, just trying to learn more.
- Original poster
- #11
Hello Nate,
It's good to hear from you again. I hope things are well with you Down Under
Now I'm well aware that specific formulae for calculating Ballistic Coefficients can be more or less accurate. They're clearly not perfect. Plus there's many environmental - and other - factors which have an effect on the actual downrange performance.
However, many people have used BCs for many years as a guide to the downrange performance of many types of airgun ammunition with reasonable success. So they're clearly generally "good enough" as a starting point for many airgun shooting purposes.
If there really is "NO WAY" - as you say - that BC vales can be calculated based on FPS at different distances downrange, then we need to understand why that is the case. In detail. Lots of people think that it is possible (with tolerable accuracy) and have done so for a long time, after all.
Plus, if we "need to move away" from BCs, we also need something to move towards. What do you propose?
Now - among many things - I am not a physicist or ballistician, however I am surprised by your statements.
Of course, I welcome your feedback. But please start a separate thread for this discussion so that this one can remain dedicated to Wolfiek.
Thank you.
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I would think 2 chronographs at a know distance giving the differential speed between them at various conditions would indeed offer an informed and futer predictable behavior, to that we can assign a value and when differant ammo is used we can again defer to this assigned value.
this value is the BC
now it my not under many condition be perfect a value but I would argue it is an exceptiable value.
now if this assigned value gives us information on ammo behavior that allows us to make better choice in or ammo as well as targeting with a given ammo choice I say it is indeed a asset?
you say we should move away for it?
okay if there is a BETTER option I could see that but is there?
please explain way we should move away from it?
Waytoomany
HAM Specialist
I am curious to see where this discussion goes.
Waytoomany.
Waytoomany.
- Original poster
- #17
Agreed!
that was my point as well it is a useful value and short of a better option why would you not use.?
I've been trying to think of a way someone might enjoy airguns without finding ballistic coefficients useful...
I came up with only two: 10meter, and backyard plinking, the knock-the-soup can-around-the-yard type.
I've found BCs immensely useful in all of the ways I enjoy airguns: sub20 field target, high power/long range field target, 100 yard benchrest, pesting, silhouettes, and precision plinking.
As a comparative tool, applying real-world BC values to various projectiles, and using that comparison to determine which projectile to use for competition, has aided in my field target success. My long range hit ratios on prairie dogs and other pests has increased over the years, commensurate to my understanding of BC and application of the concept through ballistic modeling programs.
I came up with only two: 10meter, and backyard plinking, the knock-the-soup can-around-the-yard type.
I've found BCs immensely useful in all of the ways I enjoy airguns: sub20 field target, high power/long range field target, 100 yard benchrest, pesting, silhouettes, and precision plinking.
As a comparative tool, applying real-world BC values to various projectiles, and using that comparison to determine which projectile to use for competition, has aided in my field target success. My long range hit ratios on prairie dogs and other pests has increased over the years, commensurate to my understanding of BC and application of the concept through ballistic modeling programs.
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