Danman
Well-known member

So (I think I'm on the right pageI have the current valve.
Eventually AOA got me the current heavier hammer too.
I didn't like the shot cycle for .177, .20 and .22 with the heavier hammer.

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So (I think I'm on the right pageI have the current valve.
Eventually AOA got me the current heavier hammer too.
I didn't like the shot cycle for .177, .20 and .22 with the heavier hammer.
My 177 HP is very quiet, I hear two things when I pull the trigger, the snap of the hammer on the valve and the thwack of the pellet hitting the target a split second later. The DonnyFL Koi moderator makes report barely noticeable. .22 def louder, but 1/4 as loud as my .22 RevereSo (I think I'm on the right page) putting your ghost back to 'what you would get today off the shelf if you bought an hp ghost' in the smaller 2 calibers, you found it a bit air wasteful/louder than necessary compared to your mods? I believe your results, I see the ghost as one of my favorite platforms and Brk bills it as a 'one system/size does all' - swap barrel sit at the bench and tune reg or hammer spring for 10 mins with ammo choice and off you go, but I think it probably leaves a bit of power off the top (bigger calibers) and probably a bit air wasteful on the smaller calibers. Lastly you found the lighter hammer you made - gave you a better fps adjustment range with your wheel then? Thanks again for the info!
So (I think I'm on the right page) putting your ghost back to 'what you would get today off the shelf if you bought an hp ghost' in the smaller 2 calibers, you found it a bit air wasteful/louder than necessary compared to your mods? I believe your results, I see the ghost as one of my favorite platforms and Brk bills it as a 'one system/size does all' - swap barrel sit at the bench and tune reg or hammer spring for 10 mins with ammo choice and off you go, but I think it probably leaves a bit of power off the top (bigger calibers) and probably a bit air wasteful on the smaller calibers. Lastly you found the lighter hammer you made - gave you a better fps adjustment range with your wheel then? Thanks again for the info!
Yes I remember reading way back that yours was special and almost a pre-production ghost. Blows my mind that there are that many (or more?!) hammers out there for it. Loving the updates, i still take it with a grain of salt in that I want the .22 very much so, and the .20 is of course your custom and (superbly performing) baby. I do pity the sub12 people in this regard for lack of tuneability. I really don't feel they get all that they pay for, for such a cool capable platform. Your shooting .20 slugs and pellets out of the same barrel right? Can I ask what your twist is on it?
So...still thinking...while the spring will deliver the same energy, the heavier hammer will have less velocity, but higher momentum when it hits the valve...and will require more force to de-accelerate/stop it...so at this point I am thinking the heavier hammer interacts (requires more time) for the valve to stop it...thus the valve is open slightly longer...and maybe slightly more....my buddy has a PhD in MechE...going to hit him up today ...this is the, for me, the unintuitive concept of momentum vs kinetic energy vs force ...they are not "the same"...I went digging....that 38grain hammer weight was worth about 100fps with the .22 MRDs in the .22 HP barrel.
View attachment 4811
So...still thinking...while the spring will deliver the same energy, the heavier hammer will have less velocity, but higher momentum when it hits the valve...and will require more force to de-accelerate/stop it...so at this point I am thinking the heavier hammer interacts (requires more time) for the valve to stop it...thus the valve is open slightly longer...and maybe slightly more....my buddy has a PhD in MechE...going to hit him up today ...this is the, for me, the unintuitive concept of momentum vs kinetic energy vs force ...they are not "the same"...
It really does get involved when pushing to the nth degree doesn’t itYes.
This concept of changing hammer weights around for desired effect is not new. Guys have been making hammers for their PCPs from various materials for longer than I've been involved in airguns. Delrin, aluminum, brass, steel, fluted, hollow, etc etc etc. And all to tweak what we're talking about here....how fast it travels, how far it travels, etc, essentially changing how much energy it imparts on the valve stem, or possibly, how those changes affect the interaction between valve stem and hammer strike.
I've yet to find the bottom of the rabbit hole.It really does get involved when pushing to the nth degree doesn’t it
There isn’t one….I've yet to find the bottom of the rabbit hole.![]()
I was talking with the guy doing my barrel yesterday and as we pulled the shroud off he suggested I experiment with how tight it was on the o rings ( it was very tight) as he thought that could be the reason for my 2 or 3 short flyers in a mag dump @ 100I've yet to find the bottom of the rabbit hole.![]()
Ok, that confuses me....in that if the barrel-shroud is the same from shot to shot...how does it being too tight cause some fliers....as they were shot under the same conditions as the non-fliers, no? I thought fliers had 4 potential components not counting me shooting them.... 1. diff weight 2. diff head size 3. damaged skirt. 4. inconsistent shot cycle...or any combo of the 4 [inconsistent shot cycle: different valve response for the same setting, shooting very quickly thus lower plenum pressure for the next shot, etc]I was talking with the guy doing my barrel yesterday and as we pulled the shroud off he suggested I experiment with how tight it was on the o rings ( it was very tight) as he thought that could be the reason for my 2 or 3 short flyers in a mag dump @ 100
I was talking with the guy doing my barrel yesterday and as we pulled the shroud off he suggested I experiment with how tight it was on the o rings ( it was very tight) as he thought that could be the reason for my 2 or 3 short flyers in a mag dump @ 100
His point of view was if the barrel did move slightly compared to the shroud it might changed harmonics till it returned to its normal positionOk, that confuses me....in that if the barrel-shroud is the same from shot to shot...how does it being too tight cause some fliers....as they were shot under the same conditions as the non-fliers, no? I thought fliers had 4 potential components not counting me shooting them.... 1. diff weight 2. diff head size 3. damaged skirt. 4. inconsistent shot cycle...or any combo of the 4 [inconsistent shot cycle: different valve response for the same setting, shooting very quickly thus lower plenum pressure for the next shot, etc]
tc
This type of behaviour is what gets me and its often much larger. This is a 50 yd br target i shot on a really calm day. Its a mag dump @ 100. Now i get that a slight breeze would be enough to be moving the group of 4 below the bull down that far from the group of 4 above the bull but how do you account for the outer 3 shots. This was to shot in probably about 1 minute or less. And like i said i frequently get larger of the same types of groups usually under 2-21/2 inches but the same general looking thing. This is also with pellets weighed to .1 grain although my scale lies a bit i think so actually their probably within .2 or .3 grain
Well thats a mag dump 11 shots in under 1 minute ? In the middle thats 8 shots 2 groups of 4 the outside edge of the green is 2”.Bloomin shotgun pattern.Consistently off is one thing, but...how wide of a target is that? 2 1/2inch groups @ 100 ain't baaaad, that's a dead starling 6 out of 11 shots? Looks like my brother's 350 magnum .177 groups @ 40/50y. But I have never shot out to 100 yet myself. I say when those new Mrds are back in stock get a tin of each and retest, and of course... post results!
Does your ghost refill the plenum pretty quick after each shot? I recall Tec had his reg cranked up and had to wait a few extra seconds for it to refill between shots.
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